Smallscreen Features

Rod Blagojevich interview, 'Apprentice' behind him, the Gov. pleads his case

By April MacIntyre Apr 7, 2010, 19:15 GMT

Impeached former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich arrives at the US District Courthouse in Chicago, Illinois, EPA/KAMIL KRZACZYNSKI

NBC's "Celebrity Apprentice" saw the ex Governor of Illinois, Rod Blagojevich, get the chop Sunday night.

At the beginning of the season, Monsters and Critics interviewed Donald Trump, and asked him about Rod Blagojevich's run which elicited a slight snort from The Donald, who said we were in for a surprise with the ex Governor.

During the course of the competition, Blagojevich deferred and deflected, and refused to make any declarative statements.  His inability to master simple modern tasks like email and texting was a death knell theme expressed over and again by his Team RockSolid peers.  Team Tenacity's Sharon Osbourne always got a zinger in, saying he looked underbaked, "his eyes too close together."

Monsters and Critics first spoke to Mr. Blagojevich in person at last year's NBC summer press day where it was announced he was part of the NBC Costa Rican "I'm a Celebrity, Get me Out of Here" lineup, only to be switched out with his wife Patti. 

Patti was an earnest player and did a respectable job on a reality series marred by Speidi, Stephen Baldwin and a sick Janice Dickinson who peed by her bed (fear of snakes) and hocked loogies the entire series until she was sent packing.

Blagojevich is a consummate politician who speaks in their special language. In the following interview he denies any wrongdoing, as any good pol would.  The verdict awaits him.

His next reality mountain to climb is a massive trial, where Blagojevich and his brother, Robert, are currently battling over undercover recordings from being aired at their upcoming trial.

In a motion filed Tuesday in federal court, the Chicago Tribune reported that Robert Blagojevich's lawyer argued that authorities had no probable cause to undertake the secret recording in the first place. The brother ran the governor's campaign fund for part of 2008.

According to the Trib, Robert's lawyer, Michael Ettinger, contended the FBI submitted no hard evidence that favors were being traded for campaign cash before agents began tapping the phones of the then-governor and some of his key advisers in 2008.

In the following interview from yesterday, Rod Blagojevich contends there is a bigger story not told, and reiterates his innocence, and shared that if not for the lifeline NBC threw him and his family, their financial situation would have swamped the family.

Monsters and Critics spoke to the ex Governor Rod Blagojevich, along with a few other online journalists:

Niagara Frontier Publications: Obviously in the boardroom Donald Trump said that he thought you weren’t I guess being as competitive as you could have been, that maybe you were taking it easy. Did you agree with that assessment?

Rod Blagojevich: I didn’t. No. I think - here’s what I’ve learned about reality television having done the Celebrity Apprentice and then my wife being involved in the program down in Costa Rica. I think when the reality TV shows like that that are really real is you generally will see the real person.

The days are long 14 hour days - 12, 14, 16 hour days, they’re one after another, you’re dealing with the same people day in and day out in a kind of cramped environment and so I think the true you for better or for worse is what you see on those shows. And so, you know, I appreciate what he was saying, but the reality is, you know, I was given the choice to call Bret Michaels back into the boardroom.

I had decided - because a lot of that challenge that we had had to do with conveying to your team from a far away place instructions on what the contest required and what the mission was. And I had chosen, I believe rightfully, that Bret Michaels because of his background as a rock star, I knew he had experience in producing shows and was the most creative of our team.

I thought I picked the right guy to kind of run the creative end of it while I was down in Orlando and then, you know, I’d be in the air for awhile basically unable to mostly, you know, do stuff and I wouldn’t be on the ground anyway. And so I think I made the right call with Bret.

And when I saw his work products and saw what he actually created regarding the Wizardry - Wizarding World, I still mix that up, Wizarding World of Harry Potter I thought he did a very good job. And for me then to sell him out because, you know, it was eminent that I was going to be the guy getting fired because I was the project manager and we lost although it was close, we were told it was close, it would have been just wrong.

I don’t think it’s good leadership. I think it’s bad leadership. You’re supposed to protect the people that work for you and who do a good job. Now if Bret did a bad job that would be a different story but Bret did a good job and I wasn’t going to sell him out knowing that I was likely to be the guy that would get fired if I didn’t.

Niagara Frontier Publications: Right. I find it very interesting though that Darryl took a bullet for Michael and it could be said that you took a bullet for Bret. This show is very much known for contestants being very cutthroat but your team seems to be taking a different approach.  What do you think your actions and even Darryl Strawberry’s actions to some extent, what does that sort of say about your team that you guys are sort of willing to sort of bite the bullet for someone else?

Rod Blagojevich: Well  I don’t think it says so much about the team as it says about Darryl Strawberry and me. I mean these were individual decisions we both made. I think had Darryl not volunteered to leave I think Michael was likely to get fired. I mean he was the project manager and we lost and it seemed like we lost that contest by a lot.

And just like in my situation I was the project manager and we lost. And,  it’s like a manager of a baseball team, you know, if you don’t have a winning season sooner or later they’re going to move the manager out and get someone else in who can win.

So I’m not so sure Michael or Curtis for example or Bret even are going to, you know, take a bullet for each other. And I think if people stay tuned and I think the show’s going to just get - without divulging anything I think the show’s just going to get a lot more competitive as it unfolds.

And I think you’ll probably see less of what you just talked about and probably more of the good old fashion back stabbing and cut throat stuff that, you know, has made Celebrity Apprentice a show that people like to watch.

Examiner:  Did you really want to be project manager on the Harry Potter task? Because it seems like right away Michael Johnson said, “All right let’s give it to the Governor.”

Rod Blagojevich: Yeah. You know what, you’re right. You’re question is well taken. When he throws it at you that way I think you got to take the challenge. At that time I didn’t know what the task was. We were then told the task after the project manager’s were chosen.

And it was interesting the irony and what was a bit - of significant concern to me was that we were told we weren’t going to know what the task was until the morning that Selita and I were supposed to meet at the Teterboro Airport. And then when we got on the plane is when we were told what this task was.

And it was very apparent to me much to my dismay that I happened to stumble into a project where I’m the project manager. And a integral part of that project is the need of the two project managers to be able to communicate with cell phones and BlackBerry’s and the new technology - e-mailing and text messaging that I completely wasn’t skilled at. And here the irony was this was going to be a big part of, you know, what the challenge was.

Had I known that was the case I might have been,  I might have made an argument for my team that we maybe we’d have been better off with someone who was a little bit more proficient on cell phones and BlackBerry’s. But I didn’t know that at the time and so I took up the challenge.

Had I known what the project was for the good of the team I would have said maybe we’re better off having someone who’s good at this technology do that part of the job and, you know, I’ll do some other role that might be better for the good of our team.

But, you’ve got to deal with the cards you’re dealt with. And not withstanding my deficiencies with cell phones and text messaging, you know, I still think, you know, at the end of the day if you look at our project and there’s it was really close.

And I’m not so sure that the inability to text message was at all the difference. I think that was a convenient excuse for Michael and for Curtis and others who, you know, let’s face it the team concept only goes so far. When there’s the possibility your team’s going to lose human nature kicks in and survival instinct steps up.

And these guys were all about making sure they pointed fingers in another place to protect their position. And, you know, the convenient thing to point to the, you know, to my lack of knowing how to properly text message as a cause for us losing. I don’t think we lost because of that. I think we lost because the women just did a little bit better than we did.

And if I take any response - if I had any regrets about what I did there was I forgot to really focus on that darn dragon. You know, when I was down at Orlando and I saw that Dragon in the Harry Potter World, you know, that mouth of that dragon should have been part of our project. I should have really conveyed that to Bret that he makes that a part of the project.

But I didn’t do that. And I regret that. Because when I saw the women did it right away I realized, you know, I missed an opportunity. And that was probably something I should have thought about doing and I forgot to do it.

Tampa Tribune: How did you discover the Children’s Cancer Center in Tampa being in Illinois - Chicago?

Rod Blagojevich: My publicist, Glen Selig is down in Tampa.  And when Patti and I were looking for charities and organizations to support when she was first on I’m a Celebrity Get Me Out of Here because of the political dynamics in Illinois with me being the governor and all that’s happened and the political relationships a lot of the organizations that I was extremely helpful to when I was governor, because they had received so much state funding they’re afraid, you know, to receive our help.

I think they’re afraid of some of the punitive response they might get form the political powers that are currently there. And so we had to look outside of Illinois. And then Glen suggested the Children’s Cancer Center which was a perfect fit for me because the best thing I did as governor was to make Illinois the first state in American history to give every child access to affordable comprehensive health care.

And this was an organization in Tampa, the Children’s Cancer Center that deals with children who are suffering from pediatric cancer. And so it was the perfect kind of cause, you know, that I had a record of fighting for and wanted to support. And the fact that it was in Tampa - we discovered it because of Glen our publicist.

Tampa Tribune:   Do you think being on the show people who may not have known you except from what they had read or do you think that they came away with kind of a different impression if they watched Celebrity Apprentice depending on how they might have thought about you from the, you know, if they didn’t know you and just saw media coverage prior to that? Do you think it helped you?

Rod Blagojevich: Well, you know, I don’t know. I’d let other people make that decision for themselves, I can’t speak for other people. All I can tell you is, you know, even before Celebrity Apprentice, you know, I’m received very warmly by most people. And a heck of a lot more so than before I was governor - than while I was governor. It’s really interesting.

And of course it’s wider now because in LA people kind of know who you are. I’m in LA today and I was in New York yesterday and people know who you are. And we were down in Sanibel for spring break for our kids in Florida and people know who you are. And when I was governor of Illinois they knew me in Illinois but they didn’t know me in these other places.

So - I mean I will say that for better or for worse I’m a heck of a lot better known. But I wouldn’t exactly say that, you know, I would choose these circumstances to get known this way. You know?

Chicago Tribune: I just wanted to sort of follow on from that question and ask, you know, about if you think - you seem to sort of be a little bit back and forth on whether you think it hurt your public image or helped it. And I wondered if...

Rod Blagojevich: Oh no I didn’t say that at all. I’m not back and forth on either one of them.
What I said was I don’t know I’ll let others make a judgment. I’m simply saying that, you know, I’m known in places outside of Illinois and Chicago since all of this has happened. Significantly more than I was when I was the governor.

Chicago Tribune:  Would any of the decision to make this appearance on the show was that partly to possibly, you know, get yourself known by potential jurors in a positive way?

Rod Blagojevich: No. Had nothing to do with it. It was an opportunity to do two things: One, to try to earn a living. The false accusations have created an environment where different people that, you know, were eager to talk to me the day before all this happened are afraid to talk to me now because of the circumstances surrounding me. And so it’s hard to earn a living and support your family.

And like most Americans we’re like everybody else we have a mortgage on our home, we have, you know, we have bills to pay, we have credit card debt, we have kids in school. And so Patti and I, you know, are doing the best we can to try to work through this and earn a living.

Unlike most people who’ve lost their jobs we’ve been fortunate and blessed in that we’ve been given these unique opportunities by Donald Trump and Celebrity Apprentice and by NBC before that for I’m a Celebrity Get Me Out of Here to be able to earn a living doing things that most Americans who’ve lost their jobs don’t get. So in so many ways we’ve been very, very lucky.

The other component is in both of the programs Patti and I have been able to actually do things that we wanted - we were able to do when I was governor and before that when I was a congressman, and that is kind of push for causes that you believe in.

So the beautiful thing about what we’ve been able to do with these shows is you can earn a little bit of a living but you can also go out and raise money for charities you believe in. And children’s healthcare has been a, you know, has been the most important thing that I did as governor. And being able to raise money for kids who are suffering from pediatric cancer is a significant, you know, appealing part of being able to do a show like Celebrity Apprentice because you have a chance to try to help that charity.

Chicago Tribune:   Would you do something like this again? You or even your wife would you do a reality show of any kind?

Rod Blagojevich: The answer is under the right (circumstance), certain types of shows the answer is yes, of course. We’ve turned down a lot of shows.

And, in the immediate wake of all of this when, our world was kind of falling in on us and our jobs were taken away from us we were offered some opportunity from several production companies the possibility of doing some shows that would be sort of like the Gosselin family and Meet the Kardashians where the reality show was about your real life.

"You’ve been governor, now you’re down and out and how are you fighting back?"  And they film you everyday, you know, with your family doing, you know, the day to day stuff as you’re trying to dig yourself out of the, you know, the hole that you’ve been kind of put in.  It’s turned out to be those kind of programs have been kind of lucrative for the Kardashians and for the Gosselins. And by the way, while I was governor the irony is I was oblivious to all of these programs.   I didn’t watch any of them, I was aware of the Celebrity Apprentice but, Meet the Kardashians and the Gosselins I didn’t know who they were and then, these offers came to us.

So we - in spite of the fact that this would have been a way to be able to probably potentially earn a very good living Patti and I both felt it was the wrong thing to do for our kids. We didn’t want, you know, it was bad enough the dramatic changes that they were being compelled to have to face - our daughters who are 13 and now 7, they were 12 and 6, 12 and 5 when all this happened. We just felt that this would be an incredible invasion, you know, and dramatic change in their lives and so we did not do that. We turned those things down.

But some of these other ones like the ones we’ve done were, you know, we’ve done them and we’d likely do them again..

Monsters and Critics:  I talked to you at the last NBC summer press day and still feel strongly that with your boxing background that you’d be a dynamite commentator - in lieu of reality TV.  Have you approached HBO or Showtime about being a boxing commentator?

Rod Blagojevich: Thank you. You know what, I’m doing to do that as soon as we get off of this call. It’s a great idea. No, I think that would be a great idea.

Monsters and Critics: You have a boxing background, correct?

Rod Blagojevich: Yeah. I boxed Golden Gloves. In fact - the first time I ever got my name in the paper was the Chicago Tribune in 1975 when I won my first fight in the golden gloves.   You know, it would be a good fit, and the political arena is not unlike in many ways,  the fight game in some respects. In fact there are more rules in boxing than there are in politics.

And, I can paint for you a metaphor or analogy about my circumstances now. I mean it’s like a - it’s a 12 round boxing match and,  the bell rang and before I got a chance to even like plant my feet I got sucker punched. Hit below the belt...purposefully. And I had to survive those early rounds but we’ve been fighting back. And I feel like ultimately when I get my chance in court to prove my innocence, you know, this is going to be an epic kind of fight.

And I’m going to come back from that sucker punch.

Monsters and Critics: Following up on something that you said earlier about new technology of e-mailing and texting. I mean Governor,  e-mailing and texting has been around for like a decade or so, can’t your daughters teach you?

Rod Blagojevich: Yeah. As a matter of fact not only can they but they are.
And let me point this out. I don’t know if this made the show the other night but I was trying to defend myself on my, you know, my ineptitude with BlackBerry’s and, you know, text messaging and typing.

I pointed out that I actually wrote a book, published, people have bought the book. And, you know, I wrote every word of it myself and I did - every chapter except the first one, I did by hand the first chapter. But I realized it was going to take too long doing that and so my daughter, Amy, she was 12 then she let me use her personal computer, a pink laptop that is hers.

And she taught me how to get on it and kind of helped me type - taught me how to type a little bit. And then we bought this thing called Dragon Speak where you can dictate into that personal computer and type at the same time. That’s how I wrote every chapter except one in my book.
Now it was, you know, the typing was slow and it was not exactly something you’d want to watch on television but I actually did it. And so they didn’t put that on - I don’t think they actually had that part of my defense in the boardroom.

The text messaging I had no clue and that was an accurate depiction. But since that time my daughter Amy who’s 13 has been teaching me and in fact yesterday she sent me like five texts, I was in New York and LA. She’s giving me updates on the Cubs opener. And, you know, it went from 8 to 5 they were losing to 12 to 5 they were losing to 15 to 5. Finally they lost 15 to 5.

She was texting me back and forth all kinds of updates and then I would respond to her. And then my last message to her was basically, “You’re the coolest kid I know.” And then she responded and said, “You’re weird.”

Monsters and Critics:   Of all the players that are left now whose your favorite woman player? Who do you think is going to triumph for the women?

Rod Blagojevich: Okay. Now you ask me who do I like the most or who do I think’s going to win?

Monsters and Critics:  Who do you think’s going to win for the women? Who do you think has it that’s going to win?

Rod Blagojevich: Yeah,  that’s a good question. You know, I have no idea how it unfolds but, I’m a student of history so I’m going to look at history and the year before Joan Rivers won. And if I’m looking at the women’s team the most like Joan Rivers on that team seems to be Sharon Osbourne.

And if you’re going to look at the one who one the year before and the qualities she has it seems like Sharon Osbourne is the - of the women’s team she’s the most closely reminiscent to me of Joan Rivers. So just based on that I would say she’s in a very competitive position so she could win.

But,  I don’t think you can - this is what’s interesting about this program and I strongly suggest people keep tuning in. You know, every event, every new challenge creates a set of circumstances that are unpredictable and so much of it is,  how the individuals respond on a given challenge. And that’ll dictate who wins and who doesn’t.

And so that’s why these are hard to predict. But I think my prediction that’s it’s going to get nastier as it unfolds because I saw signs of that developing already. I believe next weeks show - and I don’t know this but I’m just speculating is going to be the beginning of the end of the era of good feelings and the beginning of the night of the long knives.

And I mean you’re going to start seeing a lot of the back and forth back stabbing positioning and the kind of cutthroat thing that, you know, that kicks in when people want to survive and they want to win at all costs. And I think you’ll see a lot of that as the show unfolds. That’s the kind of entertaining stuff people like to watch.

Monsters and Critics:  Absolutely. Well I look forward to seeing you on HBO or Showtime for boxing.

Rod Blagojevich: I love it. And thank you. And if it ever happens I’ll give you all the credit.

Hollywood News: Since you’ve talked about your intentions as far as doing reality TV as the trial looms are you hopeful for a positive outcome?

Rod Blagojevich: I’m certain of a confident outcome. I know that I’m going to be vindicated because I’ve done absolutely nothing wrong. The government secretly taped my telephone for six weeks. And how upside down is it when they then take snippets of conversations and they take it out of context and then they falsely accuse you of things like you’re selling the President’s senate seat for money? Which is one of the biggest lies ever told

And the tapes are there and I’m the one who’s been accused - I’m the one who’s advocating that every tape be heard and it’s the opposite of Watergate and Richard Nixon. When Nixon knew he did something wrong and his whole struggle was to try to keep those White House tapes from being released publicly.

I from the very beginning have said play every tape. The tape will show what the truth is. The tape will show that I have been lied about. The tapes will show that.

And the irony is that my accusers have gone to court and prevented me from telling you exactly what’s on those tapes. And so finally we’ll have a chance in court and the judge has said that when I testify he’ll allow those tapes to be heard. And the tapes will show what the truth is. And there’s nothing like, you know, taped conversations.

It’s pretty frightening to think that the government can tape your telephones in your home. On the other hand if you’re an honest person and you’ve done things honestly and you never intended to break the law and you’ve been talking to your lawyers all the time to make sure you do things right then, you know, the tapes are going to be the sorts of things that will show what the truth is. And the tapes will be among the reasons why I’ll be vindicated.

And I think what you’ll really have here is going to be an epic story about how things have gone the way they have and how a governor elected by the people twice was stolen from the people based upon false accusations and a big, big lie.

Winston Churchill said, “A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth gets a chance to put it’s pants on.” Well the truth is on those tapes and when I have a chance finally to go before my fellow citizens, 12 of them, they’ll have a chance to hear what those tapes say and those tapes will, you know, give what the truth is.

And I look forward to my opportunity to be vindicated and get on with hopefully what I would like is a chance to be able get back in there and do what I’ve done my whole adult life and that is, you know, do things for people. And I’m not writing myself off as someone who’s going to run for public office again someday.

Hollywood News: Based on the goodwill you mentioned you were receiving people who come up to you do you think after these incidents if you ran again you would be able to win another election?

Rod Blagojevich: Well,  I’ve never lost an election. And I think among the reasons why I never lost an election was, you know, I never, you know, two things I never took the people for granted, never assumed I was going to win I just worked real hard to try to get elected. And then, you know, put forth, you know, positions and principals and policies and viewpoints that I believe in and believe deeply in. And so that recipe’s always worked, I’ve never lost an election.

If I were to run for office again someday, I wouldn’t predict the outcome I would just do what I’ve done in the past. And I do think,  I do think when this is all said and done and the truth comes out,  I think it’s going to be startling and very historic in so many ways.

And I think having to go through something like this as difficult as it’s been from a personal standpoint, I think there’s a purpose. I think God has a purpose for all of us in different ways and I think this is going to serve some sort of a good public purpose too. And I think part of it has to do with the fact that there are no checks and balances anymore on some of these prosecutors who believe in grandstanding and are determined to go out and try to get somebody. And where is that check and balance?

And hopefully my case will be the beginning of trying to set that right. And the media with all due respect to your profession whatever happened to a probing, inquisitive media that might have some, you know, reasonable skepticism?

The (Fourth Estate) is supposed to safeguard our democracy but where have they been in terms of asking questions like, “Is it really possible that a governor in a state like Illinois would be so ridiculously out to lunch to think to come out selling the President’s senate seat for money? Is that really possible?”

And this governor has been saying all along that what he was doing was working with the president’s top staffers, his Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel to try to put a political deal together to appoint his political nemesis’ daughter in exchange for the creation of 500,000 jobs, healthcare for 300,000 people and protecting taxpayers from higher taxes.

Someone is not telling the truth. Is it possible that maybe the governor’s telling the truth and that the guy who says you ought to play all the tapes may be actually telling the truth? And the ones who’ve gone to say, “Don’t hear the tapes,” might be the ones who are lying? And where’s the media to really press and ask those questions?

And the fact that a governor who was elected by the people was taken out of office based on these false accusations where is the media to start asking maybe there’s something to what he’s saying?

I think when ultimately 12 people sit in a courtroom and see what the truth is and the outcome comes out and the truth prevails then I think maybe I think this case will sort of change what’s happened to the media today.

And, it’s a combination of, they trip all over each other to follow a storyline and I guess they’re understaffed, it’s become more of a business. And the days of Woodward and Bernstein, are long gone.

 I sure wish we had Woodward and Bernstein today because there’s an epic story here and if any you guys got a few extra hours you may want to make a name for yourself and get on this. Because this is a story that’s completely upside down.

Hollywood News:  Your teammate Darryl Strawberry suggested that maybe you were trying to hard to talk about your innocence. Do you have a response to that?

Rod Blagojevich: Yeah. Darryl’s a real good guy and he’s tremendously big hearted. Got to know Darryl. I really liked him. And Darryl’s, you know, known what it’s like to go through some difficult times himself personally and it’s, you know, it’s gotten him reconnected with his faith.

We talked about that and his own personal redemption and him working through some of those problems. And he’s a very sensitive, genuine guy, and you wouldn’t expect that from a big, strong athlete like Darryl Strawberry.

I think he says that to me because,  I think he’d like, he’s just, I don’t know. I don’t want to speculate on what his thinking is.
I would only say that the answer is when you haven’t done anything wrong and you’ve been falsely accused as I’ve been, slandered as I was and you’re an honest person and your integrity means everything to you it’s about what your kids see and the values your kids are learning and making sure that they can be proud of their father and not believe the lies.

And it’s about your hardworking parents who sacrificed and suffered. And they taught you and brought you up, in Sunday school with a set of values to be honest and to do your response - meet your responsibilities.

There’s so much at stake here from a personal level that,  I can’t help but keep saying to everybody and anybody who might be willing to listen, “It simply is not true, what they said about me and I want you to know it’s not true and I’ll prove it to you.”

And so I get what Darryl’s saying but the reality is I didn’t do anything wrong and I’m fighting back. And I don’t know what am I supposed to do? You know, say I did these things when I didn’t? I didn’t.

And, I think it would be wrong for me to be anything but to be as forceful as I possibly can. Ultimately I don’t care how powerful the forces are that are right against me as Abraham Lincoln said in his speech in 1860, “Right makes might.” And the truth is I didn’t do anything wrong.
I was trying to pick a senator who I don’t even like because I could do the most good for the most people in my state. And we were doing the kind of politics that Abraham Lincoln would respect and would probably strongly approve of. And for the government to lie about me the way they did it’s just upside down.

And again ultimately the tapes are going to show what the truth is and in the meantime,  I’m going to do everything I can to keep pointing it out myself.