People News
By Stone Martindale Apr 24, 2007, 17:29 GMT
Jessica Lynch debunks 'hero' myth, stands with Tillman's family
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Older Talkback
Oh Kevin,
One thing that comes from flying military helicopters for three decades is that you learn that some may have good intentions and even serve a deployment and yet still not understand .... or even have a vaguest clue.
We had a lot of fun laughing about guys who talk/write like Kevin. Strong opinions, doesn't know when things are appropriate, and easily identified by others that understand. His remarks about friendly fire clearly show he has never had a MOS (a military job) that required him to really understand the issues.
Now that I've finished laughing at him, let me address him directly. Kevin, medic to nurse: nice progression; serving overseas: thank for your service, it is appreciated; and lastly a suggestion: please talk about thinks you understand (e.g., the consequences of some troops not having the right body armor and the wounds they sometimes received, poor treatment of National Guard/Reserves after intial medical treatment, etc).
Last, my highest respect for both Pat Tillman and Jessica Lynch
I walked to the train station the other day to go to work, after work I walked back. I left my car at home, it's been sitting there ever since.
What a concept, walking. Can you imagine??
Buses, car pools, bicycles, motorcycles, trains... and many of these carry more than one person, wow!
And motorcycles.... do you know that in the Bay Area (San Francisco, Oakland, San Jose, California, yeah, that Bay Area) there are nearly 6,800 motorcycles ridden daily to commute? And the traffic is still awful. Now imagine if we switched riding those motorcycles and drove our cars....
We do have ways to minimize the use of oil, however, convinience, lifestyle and blaming someone else for the abusive consumption keeps us tied to those countries who have the oil. Don't misunderstand, I like oil, needed actually otherwise I wouldn't be able to ride my motorcycle. My choice, and yes I am an Organ donor, so don't go there. However, my need is minimal. I enjoy walking as much as I enjoy riding, it's my contribution to 'green'.
I know that there are hardship stories why people can't take public transportation or walk, or whatever the situation may be, and there lies the need. How do we as a community provided transportation to the masses, those in need, and reduce the oil consumption?
What does this have to do with the war in Iraq?
How many millionaires get to be $$ due to oil? And what ever happened to philanthropy? And why can't we as a nation take care of our own with those of us that make so much $$ from our countrymen's labors?
What does this have to do with the war in Iraq?
9/11 spells Osama bin Laden
What does this have to do with the war in Iraq?
We are in two wars, one to get justice for the wrong that was done on Sept. 11, another because we wanted to spare a country from a dictator who was no good to his countrymen and Hey! look at all the oil refineries he has!!... what a nice prize to go along with our good deeds.
We made a stand for 9/11 and I beleive in that stand. Osama bin Laden must be served Justice.
I served my country in the Army, six years. It drove me crazy that I got out three years before the Gulf War. As a single parent I couldn't return to my military family and fight alongside them. Wasn't that about oil as well?? But I would have fought with my brothers and sisters, we have a fierce desire to live and protect ourselves from the 'enemy' even if we disagree with the reason why wars are fought. I've always found it interesting that the military fights for Democracy and for obvious reasons the military is not democratic at all. Just an observation not a condemnation. If the military was a democracy... disaster.
I wasn't a nurse, I wasn't a typist, I wasn't a cook, I was a 52D30 - Generator Mechanic Supervisor. I worked on generators to supply electricity to deployed battallions. Generators so cooks could serve a hot meal and actually see what they were cooking...lol, generators for medical units to patch up the wounded and send them back hopefully not to get killed, generators to supply cooling systems to trailers where the high tech unit personnel could input data to fire the missiles accurately.... consider it a giant Playstation with real shoot-em-up guns... Generators... you get the idea.
And afterall that, my heart breaks knowing and yet understading why we join the military and fight and sometimes die for our country... Conflicts can be so vague at times we need to come up with reasons for our military presence. I've not lost focus - it's 9/11
I beleive the Lynches and Tillmans that serve our country are part of the best we that serve and protect.
How can we possibly justify 'our' war to those who want so much to protect us, so patriotic, so vengeful, so ready to give their lives to protect our Constitution?
I've never been so proud of our military as I am today, though somewhere up the line they've forgotten who the soldiers are, the ones on the line that fire that M-16, that missile, that majic round that makes it ALL better....
There are great officers that have tremendous integrity, honor and discipline, and then there are those who see only a GI - Government Issue - a number. When they are needed the most to protect their own, they seek out their own protection, they are infact the Friendly Fire
hosdaddy
Yes ,[THE PROJECT FOR A NEW AMERICAN CENTURY].WAS QUITE REVEALING.
The fact that Iraq is such a mess probably saved Russia
The Sponsored Orange and Rose revolutions...were just the forerunner to a bigger squeeze play for Russia's oil/gas..and her pipelines..
and that it was all preplanned and just waiting for the right administration to come along is totally amazing.
we will never win the war on terror. it is an ideological war just like the war on drugs. who will sign the peace treaty to end the war on terror? we are destined to wage an unwinnable war as we flush more lives and money down the toilet. the money doesn't bother me, you can always make more money, but the loss of lives is senseless. the iraq war was a crock when it started and it's a crock today.
for your information i am retired. Also i dont care what you liberal jerks did in the military i dont care if you attack my service because calling me these names just shows my point that any p.o.s. can be called a hero. if you think jessica lynch is of upstanding moral character just think about how often her accounts of what happened have changed. as for tillman no one has yet to explain why he was by himself and why he didnt have a radio. it sounds like foul play. finally i am from baton rouge and i am not a coward i put my phone number up earlier just so if you wanted to make threats you libs could just like you jerks do on the sean hannity show
Jessica Lynch should have been happy with a 'light coverup' and been happy with the 'hero' label she got...now that she opened her big mouth (for more 5 min of fame and money)...lets the world know the truth...that she was raped repeatedly and gave all the dirty,stinking Iraqi men oral and anal sex...let the truth be known just how her back was actually hurt....this girl apparantly has no honor or pride in herself or her country.
Funny Jessica 'gets religion' right about now. I wonder if she's going to return her Bronze Star and all the money she made from her big book deal?
former helicopter pilot...you couldn't pilot a team of dog sleds...and probably got all your information while sitting your drunk self at a bar over-hearing real vets and active service men tell of their experiances...i bet you probably even tell others how your got your DFC....BS...and MOS is (Military Occupational Specialty)....moron commie.
Wonder why the dems in Congress don't pass anything demanding pullout from Afganistan... just wondering.
Oh, its because this poor country would be taken over by the Taliban.... and Iraq ... hhmmm. ehh..hmm..
I get it!
I spent a lot of time in the US on business during the lead-up to the Iraq war and couldn't believe the amount of media saying that Iraq and 9/11 were connected. The snow job was horrendous, and I don't blame the general populace for believing it. I fully support going into Afghanistan, by the way. We are there, too, and our men and women are fighting and dying there. I'm Canadian. Women have combat roles in our military. The loss of a female forward artillery officer in battle made national news, yes, and she died bravely and honourably by all accounts, but there was nowhere near the kind of bizarre publicity that was centred around Jessica Lynch. I don't blame her for that. She seems like a pretty simple girl. It would be pretty easy to be railroaded by the mighty US military machine. It takes guts to do what she is doing now. As far as Pat Tillman goes, from what I can glean about this guy I seriously doubt he would have been happy about the way his death was portrayed. He seemed to be honestly patriotic and idealistic. Friendly fire unfortunately happens in any war. Lately it seems all to often. You guys have offed quite a few of us in the last few years. Sure it's not on purpose? And no, we are not in Iraq. What for? If Bush had the urge to remove a tinpot dictator to free an oppressed people, why didn't he go after Mugabe? Zimbabwe has the world's lowest life expectency and inflation of 1000% thanks to him. I guess Zimbabwe had nothing that Bush wanted.
The news media hypes many things; often, they are like hyperactive children in a sugar shop. That's why it is important to pay close attention to what is specifically stated, and not just what you think you heard.
Although Zimbabwe has no oil, it is the second-largest exporter of platinum. What is more, China is the largest foreign investor in Zimbabwe, and is supplying it with weapons. I guess that China sees more value in Zimbabwe than does Canada?
Did you ever wonder why the U.S. picked Iraq instead of Iran? They both have oil; in fact, Iran has more than Iraq. The U.S. could have picked many countries, if all it wanted to do was displace the dictators of oil rich nations. So, why Iraq? It wasn't the weakest; it isn't the most oil-rich. And, it would have been so easy to cut the same illegal oil deals that Canada, France, Germany, the U.N. and so many other nations did with Saddam. But, I don't want to confuse you with the truth. You like your simple answer, that the U.S. simply took advantage of poor, helpless Saddam to steal his oil. The idea that Saddam was a threat to the region, that his military attacked 5 nations within 15 years, that he was doing all he could to deceive the U.N. weapons inspectors while still keeping his opportunities open to rebuild his WMD programs-- all of that is too much truth for you to handle.
Mr Kevin Cromier, your posts have shown you to be a very uninformed individual passing off as an expert. If you were merely passing opinions, that would have been fine except that you tried to pass them off as fact.
You said that there was no such thing as friendly fire. Moreover, you claimed that with a radio this would never happen. You obviously have never stepped out of the safe confines of a base camp. Ever heard of fog of war, where comms are patchy at best? Now, get thrown into a maelstrom where you can't see the enemy but fire is coming from every direction. Add green, nervous, trigger-happy troops with a M16, M203, 0.50 GPMG or anything that can shoot and we are just one step away from a deadly mistake.
Here's a real life case - care to explain how 2 A-10 Warthogs shot up a British armored convoy near Basra, Iraq on Mar 28 2003? I bet the pilots must have lost money &/or women to the Brits and were waiting to commit fratricide.
You said that you were retired, yet you said that you knew J. Lynch. Pray tell when and where you served in the same unit as her. For the purpose of the discussion, how does it distract from the fact that she is now helping all of us to see more clearly the conduct of this war, and the sordidness of the architects. Why do you also tarnish the memory of P. Tillman? One cannot help but question your motives and feel inclined towards baser ones.
according to her own accounts she was NOT sexually assaulted. She was badly injured thats for sure but not sexually assaulted. We have two problems in this country, One is Washington for sure but the other is the media, the media is no better than the politicians
Backbone... you said 'As americans we are all such cowards and simpletons. We can't figure out that we need to flood Iraq with soldiers and overcome this challenge.'
So why are you wasting your time writing here when you could be in Iraq fighting?
Kevin, Kevon, Kevin.... OH dear....
Quite while you still can.. You have obviously been listening to too many US Army intelligence brieifings whilst you should have been counting the Brufen in the Pharmacy.
Having been on the receving end of allies aircraft (A-10), tank, mortar, artilley and small arms fire in numerous places in the world I can assure you that (1) its not friendly and (2) it does happen.
The Fog of War is not what happens when you sit on your toilet in the field. or other hospital and let go of your fear!!
Regardless of any amount of planning or communications I can assure you that a battle is one of one the most uncoordinated acts when the first bombs or bullets start to fly. (and I am not talking about the Playstation 3 type battle which is what you are probably more used to).
Sexually assaulted? No. That was another US propaganda lie. And she got special treatment in Iraqi hospital. (The special bed they used for her was turned into garbage during 'rescue' by the US soldiers)
As links aren't allowed here, search for 'Little girl Rambo' article in Guardian(co.uk)
'Initial reports also suggested that Ms Lynch had been abused after she came round in the hospital. She said the reports were lies: she had been treated well and the Iraqis had tried to return her to US forces.
'The nurses tried to soothe me and return me,' she told the hearing, adding that she objected to the way in which the US military had portrayed her.'
For all we know Jessica Lynch could be lieing to help the anti war anti military movenment. I dont believe a word anyone says anymore. The same media who lied about her is the same who is reporting all this stuff. Now out of the blue she is teaming up with anti military people. Next Jessica will be hanging out hanoi Jane and Cindy Sheehan. The problem I have with all this hog wash is Jessica herself doesnt remember anything (so she says) so anything that she may think she remembers may or may not have happened. Its all political propaganda first they use her for pro war now the dems are using her for negative propaganda
against the military and govenment. The worst part of it all it works all the american sheep BAAAH. Guess Americans havent figured out yet that our media is like the british tabloids the sun ect. There all liers and spin any which way they choose.
Watching a neighbor spend themselves into bankruptcy and beat his wife is painful. You can't stop the idiot, no matter how much you try to convince him otherwise he refuses to back down. It always starts innocently enough, a new fishing boat, the kids sent to the fancy private school upstate, the slightly louder then usual argument about money. But each time it ends the same, assets sold at auction to the highest bidder willing to pay 20 cents on the dollar.
When an American is killed we don't report it here, we simply don't care. Most of the world doesn't care. End of the day most of us care more about the kids dying in Africa then a few dead yanks its not like there is a shortage of yanks.
Sure it must have been said already (in reply to Kevin Cormier), but there are numerous instances of friendly fire occuring, such as US planes attacking clearly marked English trucks. Stray bullets are a fact of life in war, especially amongst the trigger happy. Supressing the truth, however, is also a common and pathetic lie that discredits all involved.
Calling Islam irrational or, as TB commented 'evil', when it is based on exactly the same kernal as Christianity, is laughable and no surprise from the lowest common denominator of a country hated by virtually every other on the planet for exactly those kind of comments. Go learn about it first before you choke on your bile.
The war as most people have concluded is about controlling the oil, not paying the market value for it. Suggesting the flooding of Iraq with an army when, if you recall, this is a mission of LIBERATION not invasion, is also darkly amusing.
I daren't even read past the first page of comments, if what i've read is typical of the idiots posting.
My curiosity got the best of me and I did some searching on the Internet for Kevin Cormier in Baton Rouge. I found ten Kevin Cormiers that live or have lived in Baton Rouge. There's Kevin Ray, Kevin Jude, Kevin Michael, Kevin Charles, Kevin Pete, Kevin Wayne and a Kevin L. That's a lot Kevin Cormiers for one relatively small city. Sounds to me like it's cousins marrying cousins. It could be an explanation for Kevin's obtuse way of processing facts.
Another factor might come into play. Kevin, how old is the universe?
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