US News
Mar 3, 2009, 19:14 GMT
Report: CIA has destroyed more than 90 'torture' tapes
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Older Talkback
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... That's just one more of your administrations 'legacies' as Commander in Chief, Mr. Bush.
Heck of a job.
You'd rather that these people had not been interrogated? You're still alive, so the interrogations must have been helpful. How do you know they were tortured? Because the article says so? The only thing we know for sure is that they were interrogated. The key point of destroying the tapes is that they show the interrogators, and CIA interrogators should remain under cover. Thank you Mr. Bush!
'You're still alive, so the interrogations must have been helpful.'
Totally false logic. Your argument lacks merit. Are you sure that you aren't JoeP? as in Joe the Plumber? I could see how you could make the mistake. The 'p' and 'b' are on the same keyboard.
@JoeB
We know that waterboarding was used three times (i.e. if you can classify waterboarding as torture - one can debate either way), so why does the article's author profess to know that 92 tapes showed torture? It sounds like bad journalism, or a journalist with an agenda. Maybe I'm just suspicious and cynical about what I read.
Come on over to my place. Lie on this nice plank. Let's see if waterboarding is torture or not. How long can you hold your breath, JoeB, before we have to get JoeP to run a rotorooter through you to drain the excess fluid? Who knows, he might even clean out some of that 'other stuff' that has backed up into your brain.
@JoeB
I read that CIA recruits are waterboarded as part of their basic training. My point is not to argue whether or not it is torture (you say yes, others say no, and still others say it is justified in some cases whether it is or not - myself included), it is to simply point out that it is one of the things that has kept this country safe after 911. I choose not to bury my head and recognize this fact. You don't have to agree, but I would recommend you open your eyes, change your colonic view of the world and put your glasses on.
What attack on us was thwarted by use of torture?
And make sure it's factual (not conjecture).
Because using your logic, if a person gave themselves coffee enemas and never got cancer, they could then say coffee enemas prevent cancer.
RE: Waterboarding Khalid Sheikh Mohammed
List of Confessions:
The February 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center in New York City
A failed 'shoe bomber' operation
The October 2002 attack in Kuwait
The nightclub bombing in Bali, Indonesia
A plan for a 'second wave' of attacks on major U.S. landmarks to be set in the spring or summer of 2002 after the 9/11 attacks, which includes more hijackings of commercial airlines and having them flown into various buildings in the U.S. including the Library Tower in Los Angeles, the Sears Tower in Chicago, the Columbia Center in Seattle and the Empire State Building in New York
Plots to attack oil tankers and U.S. naval ships in the Straits of Hormuz, the Straits of Gibraltar and in Singapore
A plan to blow up the Panama Canal
Plans to assassinate Jimmy Carter
A plot to blow up suspension bridges in New York City
A plan to destroy the Sears Tower in Chicago with burning fuel trucks
Plans to 'destroy' Heathrow Airport, Canary Wharf and Big Ben in London
A planned attack on 'many' nightclubs in Thailand
A plot targeting the New York Stock Exchange and other U.S. financial targets
A plan to destroy buildings in Eilat, Israel
Plans to destroy U.S. embassies in Indonesia, Australia and Japan in 2002.
Plots to destroy Israeli embassies in India, Azerbaijan, the Philippines and Australia
Surveying and financing an attack on an Israeli El-Al flight from Bangkok
Sending several 'mujahideen' into Israel to survey 'strategic targets' with the intention of attacking them
The November 2002 suicide bombing of a hotel in Mombasa, Kenya
The failed attempt to shoot down an Israeli passenger jet leaving Mombasa airport in Kenya
Plans to attack U.S. targets in South Korea
Providing financial support for a plan to attack U.S., British and Jewish targets in Turkey
Surveillance of U.S. nuclear power plants in order to attack them
A plot to attack NATO's headquarters in Europe
Planning and surveillance in a 1995 plan (the 'Bojinka Operation') to bomb 12 American passenger jets
The planned assassination attempt against then-U.S. President Bill Clinton during a mid-1990s trip to the Philippines.
'Shared responsibility' for a plot to kill Pope John Paul II
Plans to assassinate Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf
An attempt to attack a U.S. oil company in Sumatra, Indonesia, 'owned by the Jewish former [U.S.] Secretary of State Henry Kissinger'
The beheading of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl
Source: BBC
There were probably other plots the general public never heard about too.
I'm surpised not to see him admitting to killing Hoffa, both Kennedy's, being a plumber at the Watergate hotel, blowing up 2 space shuttles and being Adolph Eichmann. A person under duress will admit to anything just so the pain stops. Have you ever felt pain, JoeB? And I mean real pain for weeks on end? Have you ever been deprived of sleep and food for weeks on end? Have you ever had a 2 litre bottle of ginger ale poured into your sinuses? After one treatment of that you will admit to crucifying Christ.
I have two words for you JoeB. They involve sex and travel at the same time. F*ck off. Take your list and wipe your mouth with it. I don't mean the orifice in your head. I mean the other one on the other end. The one you speak out of. That is what your list is worth.
They want to blow me up - torture away. Frigg'n liberals are gonna be the end of our fine country.
must be republicans
You were asked to list 'factual thwarted attacks'
Factual, would include arrests (with real people being arrested) for real plots.
Got any of those?
(even Al Qaeda says the shoe bomber was a wannabe nut case, not associated with them)
JoeB ... Confessions under torture, with no resulting arrests DO NOT qualify as 'evidence of thwarted attacks'.
As pointed out before, you can get ANYONE to confess to ANYTHING using torture.
Do you understand why we oppose the use of torture?
It's not because of what it does to the ones being tortured ... it's because of what it does TO US! IT destroys our nations credibility, and wipes out any world support we might have in fighting terror.
Do you understand that to win the war on terror, we need world support?
Our public position of using torture, turns the world, the whole world, against us. Precisely when we need their support.
Evidence of that is shown in how any world leader that publicly says they support our use of torture, commits political suicide in their country (e.g. Blair)
You really have no concept of the big picture.
BUt you are happy and eager to let your 'fears' cause you to abandon the very principles the USA was founded on.
You really don't get it ... your fear destroys you, and by that YOU let the terrorists change your principles ... in so doing, you let them have their goal.
What I'm asking you for is:
Actual thwarted attacks, with actual people arrested, AND FOUND GUILTY ... as A DIRECT RESULT of information obtained through the use of torture.
Got any of those?
isn't apologizing...is he...notice too,that Obama refuses to rule out rendition of captured people to other countries. I guess he's not against outsourcing after all. Good move, considering it keeps his skirts clean while still getting the bad guy interrogated, and you can be sure THEY do not just waterboard OR record it. Make sure to remember, too, that no one has broken any american laws here.
Business as usual.
Oh do shut up. Go grow your drugs. That is something that you know a little about. Even if you did have to go to Grasscity.com to get that info.
That the US prosecuted Japanese officers as WAR CRIMINALS after WWII for waterboarding?
YEs, that's a fact.
We prosecuted them for doing the very same thing Bush and Cheney did.
Re: Not breaking US laws ... duh, Bush and Cheney had the law re-written to support their desire to waterboard ... it has little REAL signigance as a standard of how to judge it (esp given the legal precedent set when WE prosecuted the Japanese after WWII for it)
Your argument is ... no surprise ... weak, ... and compared to our own past prosecution of it ... illegal.
They don't want to blow you up. They'll let you die naturally, of terminal stupidity. That is a torture worse than waterboarding. Nasty b*st*rds aren't they?
Is it a first and only case of double standards by West in general and US in particular?
Compare to other crimes those are peanuts not worthy being mentioned.
Bush's destruction of world support for our efforts in the war on terror are undeniable.
(babble if you must ... but everyone knows he turned unprecedented support for us immediately after 9-11 into world condemnation of us)
Yes, Bush turned the world against us ... WHEN WE NEEDED IT MOST ... and his support for torture was a primary factor.
Do you think that helps us?
If so, you're nuts (ok, so we already know you're nuts)
Be certain that if ever Obama was to defend torture and renditions the world ,and most US citizens that voted for him would condemn that .Something that probably never crossed your mind.Democrats defend principles,not presidents .A free citizen is never a vassal of a president,you are,we are not .
As things stand now there is no reason to be alarmed.Your animosity towards Obama is yet another proof of that .Indeed you suffer from an incapacity to go beyond allegiance to your chosen leader.We sir,are free thinking persons we pledge allegiance to principles....Now go sit on a chilli....
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