Movies News
By Mary McSweeney Oct 13, 2007, 23:22 GMT
Catholic League condemns 'The Golden Compass'
And Also
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Older Talkback
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How very SAD those of you that do not know Jesus and his word. Because if by chance you had any idea just how powerful and mighty he is you would change how you think. Just where do you think your existance came from? A monkey!! If it was'nt for our Lord we would not be here. I would like to see that monkey create the world that we live on today. I can't hardly wait when our Creator comes to take us home, the look on your poor souls face! And if by chance you could read the Bible you then would know that He is a very loving and forgiving God and he will forgive you. And if you do come across a Bible try to find John 3:16. thats a good start for you! Oh and maybe Genisis 1:1
Heidi, you ask, 'Is it the right of Hollywood to tell our children that God does not exist?'
I ask, 'Is it the right of Hollywood to tell our children that god DOES exist?
I'm thinking of the very worst propaganda movie of all time. 'The Passion of the Christ'.
I am an atheist, however if my kids wanted to see that idiotic movie, I would let them. Then we would discuss how the movie is presents the dogma of Christian faith.
THAT is the parents responsibility. To help kids sort things out and to determine what's baloney and what's feasible.
Parents who expose their kids only to dogma are irresponsible whether they are Christians or atheists. Yes, atheists should tell their children about Christian dogma. It's part of our culture and kids should know what many believe.
I quote H. B. Hodges, 'Enjoy fantacy, believe it not.'
Marilyn LaCourt
YES! we as parents should tell our children the truth. But obviously some of you don't! You have already formed your on opinion on religion and your only going to express that to their vulnerable minds. Therfore their brainwashed to beleive with how they are raised. So what chance do they have! It is less of a challenge to be a atheist and take the easy way out, then it is to stand up for the truth and have something to believe in. What COWARDS! The world is so afraid to speak up and have a backbone. OH My Gosh! what would the neighbors say if they saw you get up and go to church. Come on people! Im with CLITTLE, and all they other Believers of Christ. He will come one day and for you it will be to late, then what are you going to tell your children, 'Sorry Billy i was mistaken' as your walking to the gates of hell. How sad. What a waste.
I, for one, am tempted to go back and correct the multitude of grammar, spelling, and syntax errors in a good number of the postings above. Why does it seem that the more zealous proselytizers commit the more egregious errors? Please don't tell me these are the ones home-schooling their children.
I am a Christian, a Roman Catholic in fact, but I love this series none the less. Have any of you read this book you are criticizing? In The Amber Spy Glass God is not killed, but rather a figure called the Authority. This figure is the figurehead of a church reminiscent of the crusades or perhaps similar to the radical Muslims of today. The church hopes to extinguish original sin by means of torturing children and removing their spirit.
None of the main characters in His Dark Materials would go to hell. No benevolent god would allow it. The characters show love, compassion, kindness, wisdom, and so many other true Christian traits. My God would not banish a kind Muslim, nor an atheist, nor a Buddhist, nor ever a Hindu to hell. Jesus is “the way, the truth, and the life” and by following Him we will be saved, but do we need to know that we are following him? Must we have a destination in mind for our path to be true? Isn’t it possible to be good without being good \because\ Jesus taught us to? If there is a life after death then it is important to exhibit kindness because it will allow us to find a place there. If there is no life after death then it is even more important to be kind because how can we allow anyone to live in pain when there is nothing for them when the pain has ended? To do so would be sin beyond all other sin, regardless of what laws say. God is love, therefore those who fight for love, fight for God, even if they see His face in a different light.
The novel is really telling us that, regardless of whether or not God exists or Christianity is correct, we need to stop looking for a future after death and see what we have NOW. Dust is not sin, but wisdom. Oftentimes wisdom interferes with doctrine and this causes confusion and fear, but it is through wisdom that humanity continues to learn and grow. We live in an amazing world and we should not lose sight of it for fear of the beyond. You don’t believe me of course, but I will try in vain to open your minds. Don’t worry I will stop long before your brains fall out. This is a quote taken from Pullman himself:
'I want to open people's eyes if I can, and their hearts and their minds to the extraordinary fact that we're alive in this world, which, although it is full of rain and mud, is nevertheless extraordinary and wonderful. And the more you explore it and discover about it -- scientifically, imaginatively, artistically -- the more wonderful and extraordinary it becomes.'
“After barely being able to finish the third book, it was perfectly clear what Pullman's views are. It's not something I would recommend to kids. How this book has won children's literature awards, I will never understand.”
Kathy, so perfectly clear you say? Don’t look at such wide a view through such a narrow lens. Life is too deep for perfect clarity.
“Children thinking for themselves? So, I take it that you will allow them to decide about whether it is OK to rape, steal and murder.”
VRuskin, Pullman is completely against all three of those things you listed. Why do you think he is angry with the church in the first place? He is upset about sanctioned murder, buying a place in heaven, and the hypocrisy of priests convicted of sexual assault. I can’t say I’m proud of the Church’s past either. That doesn’t prevent me from trying to change things for the better.
“Well theres always plenty of paedophile priests who go around dioceses unpunished, because the Slush Fund buys off the parents, and prevents the satanic perverts from going to jail........”
Cynic, ahh the brilliant point you could have made if only you saw fit to word this less insultingly.
“Well, Hollywood, we are not going to buy your attempt to pervert reality by using your biggest voice, the movies, to tell us that we all believe a lie.”
Objectively Christian, I’m pretty sure Hollywood is just out to make money. Not admirable for sure, but not an attempt to tell us we believe in a lie. Pullman is the one who thinks we believe in a lie, and if we wish to remedy the situation we must prove our worth. We need to show what it means to be a Christian so clearly no one will be confused and see our works as shallow.
“'The Bible' is a badly written, ill-informed, mis-translated work of fiction that attempts to tell people things about the nature of the universe that it has not one scrap of evidence for.”
Elf, I must agree on the ill-informed part (after all, how long ago was the Bible written? they knew nothing about science!) but the poorly written part is incorrect. The Bible is an amazing work to be sure. It along with the Koran, The Epic of Gilgamesh, and other such works began the literary tradition. Literature is a fantastic thing and such beautiful old examples of literature should be treasured, regardless of religious convictions.
“God will prove himself to these atheists and the truth is, if they do not accept Jesus Christ as their savior they will go to hell.”
Heidi, err no. What was the point of Jesus dying on the cross to save us if we still have to be perfect ultimate beings of good and light to get into heaven? If you want to embrace God’s teachings please embrace them all, not only those that make you feel superior.
“We have to start taking responsibility for allowing this to go on as long has it has and some point stop supporting this trash. If in music or movies it's time to starting telling these kids NO IT'S NOT OK TO SEE THIS OR LISTEN TO THAT.”
Mom, don’t ever call literature trash, especially when it isn’t true. The scope of His Dark Materials is incredible and even those who disagree with the author’s views should see the merit of this work. You also need to realize that Pullman is not telling your children to do anything amoral unlike the music I’m sure you are referring to. Please take the time to read some interviews with the author.
“I do not understand why Catholics try so hard to defend their ideas, I think they are scared of losing the money they people gives them every year. They are a bunch of liars and do not care about the destiny of our soul or all that crap.”
LuinGil, I’m very sorry you feel this way. I would love nothing more than to dispute this, except I’m just one Catholic and I cannot speak for the rest of them. I’d like to think I’m not a liar, and I wish I could care about the destiny of every soul, but unfortunately my heart is just not big enough. The more I think about all those who suffer the more I am lost in the enormity until I cannot see the trees but for the forest. In the end I can only do my best for those whom I can touch. I hope you will forgive me my limitations.
“Did you know Harry Potter was based on homosexuality?”
Mskate8, what does that sentence even mean? Harry Potter isn’t any more homosexual then a rock. You really must do your research.
“As a Catholic my big problem with Pullman is that unlike Hitchinns,Hariss or Dawkins he single's Christanity out.”
Jack, I love you for your sensibility. There is a reason he singled Christianity out. Please read this quote: “It's not just Christianity I'm getting at. The reason that the forms of religion in the books seem to be Christian is because that's the world I'm familiar with. That's the world I grew up in and I knew. If I had been brought up as an orthodox Jew, I would no doubt find things to criticize in that religion. But I don't know that world as well as I know Christianity.” I’m sure you are still upset, but that is completely reasonable. I can only ask for you to try and understand where the author is coming from. Empathy is a wonderful human quality.
“I can't hardly wait when our Creator comes to take us home, the look on your poor souls face! And if by chance you could read the Bible you then would know that He is a very loving and forgiving God and he will forgive you.”
Clittle, I do not enjoy hearing of your hypocrisy. No benevolent loving god would do such a thing. The God you worship must be very different from mine.
“THAT is the parent’s responsibility. To help kids sort things out and to determine what's baloney and what's feasible.”
Marilyn LaCourt, a clever point to be sure, but in the future please don’t insinuate my religion is baloney quite so heavily. If you truly want your children to decide what they believe for themselves it is important to limit the bias in your tone when explaining Christian “dogma”.
'He will come one day and for you it will be to late, then what are you going to tell your children, 'Sorry Billy i was mistaken' as your walking to the gates of hell. How sad. What a waste.'
Ah, “Believer in the truth” what makes your truth so much better than theirs?
And finally, Fanfandorin, I am eternally grateful for you sense when faced with such adversity. It is very admirable.
Christian fan, I love how you sorted out the many hypocracys and offensive, false cooments placed by christians and even some aethists alike. To those who still have closed minds, note that I, a radical aethist in the extreme, am congradulating a christian! When has that ever occured in this violant dipute website? I am highly criticle of Clitte, (whatever kind of name that is) and Objectively Christian. Please guys, have some moral integrity and an open mind. Christian Fan made me consider catholicism much more efectively than criticl comments.
If people would take time to study the history of the Roman Catholic church, they would find them guilty of much greater things then producing a movie which doesn't coincide with their way of thinking. If the church were still a power, it would just be to bad for the Author...
I wonder how many people have died in the name of god.
I know, lets compare how many people have died in the name of god, or been tortured vs, oh, lets say Buddhism.
I can't say they're is or isn't a god, but if he/she is up there, I'd have to imagine he's looking down on the 'Christians' wondering how it all went to wrong.
First off, I know there is freedom of speech, press, religion and all that stuff. And I'm not saying that it is wrong to write a book about that stuff, but a childrens book???!!! I mean, come on! I also think that they should not be making a movie on this book. I think this book and movie is soooo wrong. I am very appaled what society has come to.
I like films that claim that God does exist, and that he looks and acts like Morgan Freeman (or George Burns, or Alanis Morrisette). Also, it seems to me that the anti-Golden Compass posters must have had an advance viewing. I know that the movie isn't out yet, but it's already labeled 'disgusting'.
I think that we all need to remember that religion and morality/values can be two separate entities. Just becasue one is not a Christian, does not mean that they are without morals. It's not a 'You're either with us or against us' world. We're all in this together. Keep your Gods and beliefs in your church and homes. Let others make their own decisions.
To the Catholic League in response to the article on The Golden Compass Boycott:
For a group who’s motto is “For Religious and Civil Rights,” you don’t seem to be open-minded about others religious rights and seem really only to be “for” the rights of yourself and those who are like minded. The great thing about the US is the rights in the freedoms of the First Amendment including Speech, Religion and Protest. To use your right of Protest and boycott against some one’s freedom of speech makes no sense to me. Maybe you could explain.
Now according to your article, you act as if Pullman has created these books for the sole propose of converting young children to atheism. I think he has written them for the children’s enjoyment of reading, imagination and learning. To take away reading, learning and imagination from our children, I’m sure we can both agree, would be a horrible thing (or at least I would hope you would agree). If these books are anything like the Harry Potters series and encourage kids to read instead of playing video games and watching cartoons, I think that is a major victory.
In the article you also mention that Pullman is a new kind of aggressive “dogmatic” atheist. This almost makes me laugh. How can atheism be dogmatic is beyond me, but to use it as a derogatory term as if Catholicism isn’t dogmatic is very funny. I hope you see the irony here, as well as the irony of calling atheism so hate filled and thinking atheist are trying to destroy Catholics. It seems that the purpose of this article and boycott is that in the same of the Catholics against atheists.
Gaining new knowledge and a little bit of enjoyment form a kid book has never hurt anyone. And if one’s faith is strong enough nothing should deter them from it. And even if it was Pullman’s intent to convert kids and anyone to atheism, why would this be any different from what most religions around the world do daily? From Mormons to Catholics to Muslims, missionary work, books and movies come out all the time to do just that…convert people to that “one true religion.” You never see a bunch of atheists protesting these books and movies afraid that their kids or they will be converted. This is because most atheists are in fact more understanding and open-minded then your group. Maybe you as the Catholic League should subscribe to your own motto a little more and be a group for Religious and Civil Rights of all people, including Muslims, Protestants, and even atheists.
Yes, it is indeed good for kids to think for themselves, to question, and to learn. That is quite a bit different from letting them make unguided decisions about raping, stealing, and murdering. Allowing them to think for themselves is not at all the same as allowing a moral free-for-all unchecked by parental input. Quite the opposite - Ithink that instilling in them proper values will lead them to the right choices in all situations, hopefully.
I think the most disturbing thing about the 'religionist' objection to this film and the books is the stifling of curiosity. Kids should wonder - people should wonder - about our world. This type of philosophical examination gets us to the unanswerable questions: Where did we come from (not just humans, but life on Earth), where do we go when life ends, and does it all, or any of it, have purpose and/or meaning? The first, well, maybe someday that could be answered, although I don't see it being answered anytime soon. Where do we go? Unanswerable - and any person or group that says they can answer that is lying. Perhaps There is a God; if so, he left that unanswerable on purpose, it would seem. Maybe it is so we would go forth and live our lives with choice, free will.
Religions tend to oppose that kind of thought. They tell you where we came from - implausibly, and impossibly - and they tell you what happens after life. If there is a God, I would think She/He would consider that the utmost
heresy, impudence, and downright arrogance.
Many Christians laugh abusively at the Muslims for their 'silly' notions about the afterlife, then see no hypocrisy when they put forth their own unknowable 'truths'.
As for meaning, I'm important to my family, and they to me, and that is more than enough to make me thankful for every day.
I won't stop my kids from watching or reading His Dark Materials or Narnia, and I hope they both spur good debate. Make them think. For themselves.
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